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Thank God for Fracking

MenInTights

not a plastic bag
U.S. Seen as Biggest Oil Producer After Overtaking Saudi Arabia - Bloomberg
America is now the #1 producer of natural gas and oil. This is something I had not heard before:
If the U.S. didn’t have this energy supply, prices at the pump would be completely unaffordable.”
We tend to forget just how unstable the rest of the world is. Without this energy boom, our gas would be "completely unaffordable". In 2008 when gas got about $4 for a sustained time, the economy collapsed. No doubt we would have seen another, probably deeper collapse without the energy boom.

Fraking may not be sustainable and it may produce some problems, but without fraking we'd be screwed right now. So, thank God for fraking.
 
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Hilander

Free Spirit
Staff member
V.I.P.

MenInTights

not a plastic bag
I've been reading about sungas or syngas. I think we're really close on viable renewables and will be able to use less oil and natgas soon. I was just surprised that BoA would say without the boom we'd be paying prices that the average person couldn't afford. Its also very exciting that we now have leverage over the oil cartel because we produce so much and are outside the cartel. It makes me see the world differently and with a lot more optimism.
 

Merc

Problematic Shitlord
V.I.P.
I think it's easily arguable that for any bit of money it's saving us, it's costing us far more in environmental damage, death and sickness of American people, lawsuits, and the price of corn. As one of the comments on the articles suggests, the price of corn has skyrocketed as a result and is affecting a lot of prices since corn is used for a ton of products here in the USA.

To me this kind of story is meant to have mass appeal but crumbles when you look at it closer. Okay, you might save a few bucks at the pump over the year, but the sheer amount of effects and effects down the road due to our natural water systems being demolished are going to be a harsh reality we have to face someday.
 

Hilander

Free Spirit
Staff member
V.I.P.
I've been reading about sungas or syngas. I think we're really close on viable renewables and will be able to use less oil and natgas soon. I was just surprised that BoA would say without the boom we'd be paying prices that the average person couldn't afford. Its also very exciting that we now have leverage over the oil cartel because we produce so much and are outside the cartel. It makes me see the world differently and with a lot more optimism.
I don't doubt without the boom we would be paying much more for gas. There for a while when it was $4 plus dollars a gallon it was killing our budget trying to afford it. Then add higher home heating costs to that we wasn't spending much money on anything but the essentials.

Lets hope we have a environmentally friendly form of energy soon before the boom ends or we destroy so much of our fresh water supply water becomes a source of war, we are already seeing conflict over it. In some of the oil producing countries they give more for water than gas. Now that would sink our economy if that ever happens.
 

MenInTights

not a plastic bag
I think it's easily arguable that for any bit of money it's saving us, it's costing us far more in environmental damage, death and sickness of American people, lawsuits, and the price of corn. As one of the comments on the articles suggests, the price of corn has skyrocketed as a result and is affecting a lot of prices since corn is used for a ton of products here in the USA.

To me this kind of story is meant to have mass appeal but crumbles when you look at it closer. Okay, you might save a few bucks at the pump over the year, but the sheer amount of effects and effects down the road due to our natural water systems being demolished are going to be a harsh reality we have to face someday.
I disagree. There is evidence that $4+ gas played a meaningful factor in the 2008 recession. Rising gas prices affect much more than just at the pump. I don't know what gas would be without fracking. When someone says "completely unaffordable" to me that means $5+. There may be some problems with fracking, but not compared to a deep recession or economic depression.
 

Merc

Problematic Shitlord
V.I.P.
I suggest you read into "some problems" because that's a criminally simplistic way of viewing it. Fracking is destroying our water supply, killing our citizens and the big energy companies doing it are being protected since nearly all the ingredients are considered "secret" meaning they can be pretty much anything.

This is a weak attempt at bought-and-paid politicians to make fracking look the slightest bit good. My favorite story about fracking is this one:

Exxon CEO comes out against fracking because it will hurt his property value

So basically, "Fuck you, American people, but please protect my multimillion dollar ranch."
 

Major

4 legs good 2 legs bad
V.I.P.
One thing that doesn't get mentioned enough with fracking is the greenhouse gas emissions. All you hear is that it cuts down on carbon emissions when compared to coal. And that's true. But what they usually don't tell you is that the fracking wells leak methane, which is a far worse greenhouse gas than CO2. For fracking to be cleaner than coal, the amount of methane that escapes has to be like 3% or less. Researchers have gone around to fracking wells in various parts of the country and found the leak rates to be much higher than that.
 

MenInTights

not a plastic bag
I read the links Hilander posted. The water use and water contamination is a huge problem. I didn't realize that so much water was needed per well. I see fracking as far from perfect. However as fragile as the economy has been over the past decade, I really believe we'd be in a depression with it.
How Fracking Has Helped the U.S. Economy
1) 2.5 Million good jobs.
2) Trade balance. We've gone from a 700 Billion dollar trade deficient to a 34 Billion deficient in a few years.
3) In check inflation. With monetizing debt of the past decade all we needed was rising fuel cost to spur rapid inflation.

I know there are problems with fraking, but at the same time I think its good to imagine what life would be without the energy boom we've seen recently. We could not survive gas rationing and stag-flation that we had in the 1970s.
 

Sim

Registered Member
It's a good thing to become less dependent on unreliable outside sources. With all problems that come with fracking, they need to be weighed against the cons of importing fossil fuels from islamists (such as Saudi Arabia) or fascists (Russia).

So fracking may be a viable "bridge technology" that helps bridging the time until better, cleaner energy sources can replace fossil fuels.
 
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