Stimulus passes House 244-188

Kazmarov

For a Free Scotland
#21
Yes, all money the government spends goes somewhere and to someone. I personally would like to see it go to not just somewhere or someone, but where it's going to kick our economy back into gear. The current stimulus package isn't designed to do that. There needs to be a lot of cutting of the items in the bill that have nothing to do with stimulating the economy and then I'll be on board. Until then I'm totally against it.
Examples? You're speaking very broadly about the bill full of specifics.
 

MenInTights

not a plastic bag
#22
The problem I have with the stimulus is it just cost too much. Remember when a trillion dollars actually meant something? This is what I seriously cannot figure out. The Democrats were rightly outraged for 8 years that Bush was spending like a drunken sailor. Does anyone remember the Clinton balanced the budget, Bush destroyed it argument? Well, this is Bush on steroids and no one seems to care.

The Democrats were also concerned about our standing with the rest of the world and now we are telling them to suffer through this recession, we are going to borrow and print money to keep us comfortable and we don't give a damn what that does to our dollar.

I'm not talking about the Democrats in Congress. Everyone knows that 75% of Congress are just dumb pricks that will do whatever they need to get back in next election. I had hoped that the anger at Bush's fiscal reign was real and more people would stand up and demand a little bit of restraint.
 

ExpectantlyIronic

e̳̳̺͕ͬ̓̑̂ͮͦͣ͒͒h̙ͦ̔͂?̅̂ ̾͗̑
#23
How much money is in the system is controlled by the Federal Reserve, and the only thing they can manipulate is their interest rate, which is currently set remarkably low for fears of deflation. Whenever money gets borrowed from the Fed, new money gets put into the system, and when it goes back to the Fed, it disappears *poof*. There is a controversy over whether we should be scared of inflation or deflation right now, but I've got anecdotal evidence suggesting that economists warning against deflation are on the right track. Namely people saying they intend to hold off on making major purchases, because they think prices are going to drop more: the textbook trigger of a deflationary spiral*.

Other countries are doing things very similar to us, and really want our economy to be strong, because when we hit bad times, they hit bad times.

A trillion dollars does mean less for the government now than 5 years ago. It can get away with borrowing money at 3% interest due to the demand for treasury notes. Given that things like upping the cash paid to the unemployed, and folks getting food stamps, etc; is expected to have the effect of 1.5 dollars for the dollar in terms of very short-term stimulus (according to an economist I heard on the radio), it seems the government is getting a phat deal there.

It's not "trickle up" economics there, but "skyrocket up" economics, since the money given to the poor and working class usually goes straight into the hands of the businesses very quickly, which causes it to have the effect of helping business, while also helping the folks it was first given to.


* My anecdotal evidence comes from my talking to people who lived through the Great Depression. One of which--a friend of my family--said he was going to start haggling for things. I thought he was crazy, but a month later I read an article about how businesses are starting to haggle over televisions and whatnot.
 
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