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Split California? Good idea or Bad?

icegoat63

Son of Liberty
V.I.P.
I've discussed this here before... and its not anything new, lawmakers have tinkered with the idea of splitting the State longer than I've even been alive.

However with budget crisis', management mishaps, and all other sorts of bafoonery occuring in my home state... Guess whats getting news again?

Four members of the Riverside County Board of Supervisors agreed Tuesday to allow a fifth member to convene a statewide meeting on the subject in the fall. Each of the four supervisors stated their objections to the secession idea, but went ahead and approved the idea of at least talking about it when Supervisor Jeff Stone said he would “personally see to it” that private funding, not public money, would be used to hold the meeting.

Since the days of the gold rush, more than 220 campaigns to split California into halves or thirds have been tossed around. Mr. Stone's vision involves persuading 13 counties to secede from the state, which he says raids local coffers to plug budget gaps.

Stone's idea has some merit, some analysts say. It addresses the problematic balance of power between Sacramento and California localities, as well as the political reality that the 13 counties in Stone's secession drive are far more conservative than the rest of the state. But the vision remains legally and politically unrealistic, many add, and is perhaps not the best solution to the problems it seeks address.

51st state? Small step forward for long-shot 'South California' plan - Yahoo! News
Ok so heres the deal.... in my opinion California is largely two states already. Your have your Liberal side (the Coastal side) and your conservative side (inland). These are two Vastly different ideologies... I've personally seen them with my own eyes... imagine the difference between West Virginia and New York.... but crammed into one State.

But this leads to a new problem... here's more from the article basically saying exactly what I said, but in relevance to Stones Split Concept;

Stone's South California would not include Los Angeles. In addition to Riverside County, the counties targeted for secession would be Fresno, Imperial, Inyo, Kern, Kings, Madera, Mariposa, Mono, Orange, San Bernardino, San Diego, and Tulare, which include about 13 million people total.

Republicans account for the majority of registered voters in all but two of the 13 counties – San Bernardino and Imperial. For that reason, the idea has merit, says Robert Stern, president of the Center for Governmental Studies.

He says the real division would not one between northern and southern California, but internal and coastal California. "This would divide the state in a way that makes political sense: liberals in coastal California and conservatives in east California," he adds. "It would allow the liberals to increase taxes to pay for those services they want, and the conservatives to reduce regulations and taxes in their state.”
Isnt this Gerrymandering?

Or does that only fall into the category for drawing county Lines?

Gerrymander means to create an artificial civil division within a particular locale for an improper purpose. It refers to the drawing of boundaries of legislative districts to benefit one party or group and handicap another. Gerrymandering seeks to violate the constitutional mandate of "one man-one vote" by created legislative districts of unequal populations. Gerrymandering seeks to draw legislative districts that isolate member of a particular political party so that a maximum number of elected representatives of that party will be elected.

Gerrymander Law & Legal Definition
how would One be able to accomplish Stones feat without getting pegged as Gerrymandering? is it possible in your opinion?


Heres a Graphic of what the idea looks like;
 
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CaptainObvious

Son of Liberty
V.I.P.
I don't think this proposal would be considered gerrymandering. The proposal is to separate the two different idealogies. Gerrymandering would be to create a district that benefits either the Democrats or Republicans when it comes to representation in the House or Senate. This isn't doing that. This is to split up the state in two.

I will say if I lived in Eastern California I would definitely support it. Taxes and spending and housing regulations have become way too much for the state to support and is killing California's economy. Either that, or I'd move out of there.
 

dDave

Well-Known Member
V.I.P.
I don't think that the Democrats would allow for the state to split into two, they have a pretty solid win during each election there and the state has many more electoral votes than it otherwise would, a good portion of those electoral votes would go to the Republicans should the state split into two.

That aside I do think that for California itself it would be good to split the state into two especially considering the financial problems there.
 

shelgarr

Registered Member
It would be good. Down here in the south we have immigration problems too that needs voter support. Our whole budget would change considering we would have lowly populated eastern CA. I hope the make San Diego the state capital!
 

Mirage

Secret Agent
Staff member
V.I.P.
It's an interesting idea. It would definitely be a more fair representation for electoral votes than simply sending the whole state one way or another. How difficult of a proposal is this to get passed though? It seems to me like it's more than just speculation. It doesn't seem very likely that anything like this would even begin to get any serious consideration.
 

Huntley

Registered Member
51st State - South California?

This idea is being pushed around by California's Republicans. I would post a link to the website I read about it but I can't (only 12 posts, I need 50 for that). But if you want go to Yahoo news and do a search. Other ideas have been Puerto Rico, Eastern Washington and a few others what are your thoughts on the idea? Would it work at this date splitting up a state? Does it make sense? What if a independent country wanted to join the union (like Canada, Japan, Taiwan, Brazil, Great Britain? Or even a 3rd world country like Mexico?

What are your thoughts?

My opinion on the splitting up of states. Not a great idea. The reason for California's size was because they had the political power do include all the mountain ranges in the direct area. Now that they are in deep debt they want to cure some of the issues by splitting up the state. Now the northern part of the state does not want to help pay the south's bills. That's not a reason to split a state. As for adding an already established country, what do they bring to the table? I love Canada, they bring allot of positives. Where Taiwan does not, only a very pissed off China.

My thought for the 51st state - Puerto Rico, they've been on the road for statehood for some time now. Time to reward them.....or is it a reward?
 

icegoat63

Son of Liberty
V.I.P.
Now the northern part of the state does not want to help pay the south's bills.
you referring to the same Southern California suggested in the Op?

The same Southern California that when includes Fresno County and below.. has remained the US of A's #1 agriculture powerhouse for the last 50 years running?

The same Southern California that accounts for $97.7 billion of the state sales output, 3.8 percent of jobs, 2.5 percent of labor income and $39.6 billion (2.9 percent) of labor and property income and indirect business taxes?

...hmpf... Sure the Silicon Valley pumps out alot of financial weight... but you're also competing against one of the largest Agri-business centers in the entire world.

in other words... Im pretty confident Southern California, sans Hollywood is gonna be just fine financially. Probably even better off after the Business Taxes from the Liberal side of the state are overturned.


 
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