So what if Jesus had a kid....

Discussion in 'Religion & Philosophy' started by Smelnick, Jan 19, 2009.

  1. Smelnick

    Smelnick Creeping On You V.I.P.

    I'm sure some of you have seen the movie "The DaVinci Code" or maybe heard about such things as Priory of Sion, Opus Diei and the Knights of Templar. Whether you have or not, I'll give you a run down on the basics of this myth or legend as some call it.

    Basically, The DaVinci code is about Tom Hanks and some lady trying to find where the Holy Grail is. Nope, not the cup that Jesus drank from at the last supper, but the daughter that some say he had with Mary Magdalene. Yes, that's right, there are myths out there that suggest that Mary of Magdelene was more than just one of his disciples, and that in fact, he was a lover of his, or wife even. And that before he was crucified, she was impregnated by him. Right afterwards, it's said that she was spirited away into hiding to give birth to the child. If this is true, it's bad for the Catholics. Bad because according to them, in order to be a saint, you can't have a wife, or have sex. So naturally they would want to make sure no one found out. Hence the Priory of Sion is created. With their military force, the Knights of Templar, they set out to protect the bloodline of Jesus so that it is never found out. So to sum it all up, here are the basic points.

    -Some believe that Jesus had a kid.
    -It'd be bad for some because if Jesus had sex, and a kid, and a wife, that means he didn't die sinless up on the cross.

    Now, personally, as far as my religion goes, it doesn't matter whether Jesus had a kid or not. It doesn't say anywhere in the bible that having a kid with your wife is a sin. So therefore, he was still sinless.

    Where that comes into question however, is if the rumours about Mary of Magdalene being a prostitute are true.

    So before I ramble on and stop being coherent in my thoughts, I have just a few simple discussion questions to pose to you on this topic.

    For the sake of the debate, lets just assume that Jesus DID die on the cross, whether or not he was actually a god or not (although I believe he was =P)

    -Do you think there is any truth to this whole "Jesus had a kid thing"?
    -Was mary actually his wife? Or was she something else?
    -What kind of impact do you think there would be if someone were to prove that jesus had a kid, whether it be sinful or not?

    I have a few more opinions myself, but I want to save them for any discussions. I have done a bit of research on this, so if you have any questions about it, I'll see if I can answer.
     

  2. Merc

    Merc Certified Shitlord V.I.P. Lifetime

    I don't think it has to do with "sin" since it's not sinful to have sex or a family, but the fact that Jesus having a child would "normalize" him. He's a divine figure and the church wants him viewed as more than that. As the son of God, I'd imagine he would be some sort of deity himself but this would be devastating to the truth if it had a shred of truth to it. There's no doubt holes in the stories and tales of Jesus and everyone in the bible but this is a big question because it's gained some grounds in the past few decades.

    All I have to say is, so what if Jesus had a kid? Is it really so horrible that he was like us? Had a family and loved someone? What's so wrong with that?

    On a humorous note, I would NOT want to be a descendant of Jesus. Talk about a shit life right there.
     
  3. Smelnick

    Smelnick Creeping On You V.I.P.

    The thing is, Jesus really was just a man. He was a god, but also a man. Normal in some ways. He still needed food, water. He still felt emotion, he wept, laughed, got angry. The bible says that he came down in the form of a man. So if you believe that he was also God, and having a kid puts him closer to our level, why wouldn't that make his crucifixion all that more devine? I guess what I'm trying to say is, if the point was for him to come down as a man, why would him being more human make his death on the cross less devine?

    Also I agree Cons, I really could care less if he had a kid or not. I think that would be cool if he had a kid.
     
  4. Merc

    Merc Certified Shitlord V.I.P. Lifetime

    Because there is no such thing as being a man and a god at the same time. You're one or the other, not both. The church wants Jesus to be seen as a divine figure because then, he's more attractive to the faithful. Not sexual obviously, but more enticing to potential followers (especially during those days of ancient civilization). Things were all about what your god could do, not what your god stood for. Jesus was a god in the way that he was a very influential person who brought a lot of good to the world.

    BUT.

    If he was just a man and the church agreed that he was just a man, he would lose a lot of that mysticism and power as the son of God if it turns out he was just a mortal man (which he most likely was).
     
  5. Chaos

    Chaos Epic Gamer V.I.P. Lifetime

    I haven't seen the film, but I have read the book. The Da Vinci Code suggests that the Holy Grail is an archive of documents tracing the line of Jesus, or The Merovingean bloodline.

    Anyway: I think that, yeah, the Vatican really wouldn't be pleased, but I don't think it would really make that big of a deal. Sure, some people would take Constantine's view; but legen has it that the old Greek gods took mortal mate's all the time. Hell, look at Hercules. There are plenty of other examples.
     
  6. Merc

    Merc Certified Shitlord V.I.P. Lifetime

    Actually Chaos, the Da Vinci Code argues the holy grail, like Smelnick said in his initial posting, is a woman. Not some chest of details and documents, but the womb carrying Jesus' child.

    If somehow it was ever proven that Jesus had a bloodline, the church would be in an uproar. Because one, the descendants would have to be hidden away from the world or relocated because of massive religious backlash. Then, the church would have to deal with their own backlash when angry faithful begin to question other "truths" in the bible. I think the response would be a lot worse than you think, Chaos.
     
  7. Smelnick

    Smelnick Creeping On You V.I.P.

    I don't know if you read the book carefully enough man.

    The Holy Grail, as depicted by the film 'Monty Python's search for the holy grail' and some other shows and books, says that it's the cup that Jesus drank from at the last supper.

    However, in the movie and book 'The DaVinci Code', it suggests that the holy grail is actually the womb of the daughter of Jesus. This being derived from the symbol of a V, the symbol of women, where as the very phallic upside down V is the symbol for man. They also talk about how the painting of the last supper has clues that support Mary Magdalene being Jesus's lover. They say that the man to the left of jesus, is actually a woman. The empty space between them is V shaped, suggest women, and womb, and if you reverse their spots (jesus and the "woman") then it looks like she is on jesus's arm. So how you got "the holy grail is a collection of documents" out of that, I don't know =P
     
  8. Matriqulated

    Matriqulated Future is Fused 3036A.D.

    We are one and not the other, but I believe the root of the confusion in general is that he was both. If one does not believe in the spirit, then how can that person believe that his spirit was all God? If his body is human but his spirit is that of God, isn't he then both if the Lord is spirit? I'm not sure that the same rules apply to God, or the son of God. But as you mentioned, his influence as a man alone led me to believe that the amount of good provided was so special it had to originate from more than just a man.

    I would not rule out that Jesus had a family and agree that having a family does not equate to sin.
    I do not know that it has ever been proven or that there is any real evidence behind the whole prostitute thing.
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2009
  9. Chaos

    Chaos Epic Gamer V.I.P. Lifetime

    Well, that was a rough synopsis on my part. I haven't read the book for about two years.

    Apologies for incorrect evidence. My emphasis was on the later part. :lol:

    Orly? I knew, according to the book, that the da Vinci Code tried to place more emphasis on women, and I remember a link between the shape of the mythical cup (a chalice) and the shape of a womb, but I don't remember the Grail supposedly being an actual female. I should probably read up on that.

    Well, considering I was mainly talking about the opening crisis stages (i.e. first discovery) of any evidence and the impact on the Christian Faith (the actual faith, not the religion), you may well be right. :lol:

    Bugger. I think Ive mixed it with another book, Labyrinth, by Kate Mosse. Extreme apologies :[ Bigtime fail. Too many books = fail at remembering individual details.

    P.S. If you haven't read Labyrinth it's an interesting Grail read. Even if I did pretty much spoil it. :lol:
     
  10. Mirage

    Mirage Administrator Staff Member V.I.P.

    One thing is for sure, simply put, it would debunk a few major religions in one fell swoop.

    First thing's first though, it would have to be proven factual before any controversy would even begin to go mainstream. "The DaVinci Code" is simply suspenseful fiction along the lines of Indiana Jones or even National Treasure. A lot of the questions it raises are based in the world the author has created. While it's a realistic drama that does include a lot of research, it's still categorized under fiction at the library.
     

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