Senate rejects limits on cluster bombs

M

Mecha

Guest
#1
[url=http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/national/1153AP_Cluster_Bombs.html]Seattle PI[/url] said:
Senate rejects limits on cluster bombs

By ANDREW TAYLOR
ASSOCIATED PRESS WRITER

WASHINGTON -- The Senate on Wednesday rejected a move by Democrats to stop the Pentagon from using cluster bombs near civilian targets and to cut off sales unless purchasers abide by the same rules.

On a 70-30 vote, the Senate defeated an amendment to a Pentagon budget bill to block use of the deadly munitions near populated areas. The vote came after the State Department announced last month that it is investigating whether Israel misused American-made cluster bombs in civilian areas of Lebanon.

Unexploded cluster bombs - anti-personnel weapons that spray bomblets over a wide area - litter homes, gardens and highways in south Lebanon after Israel's 34-day war with Hezbollah militants.

Sens. Dianne Feinstein, D-Calif., and Patrick Leahy, D-Vt., have long sought to keep cluster bombs from being used near concentrated areas of civilians. They say that as many as 40 percent of the munitions fail to detonate on impact - they can still can explode later - leaving innocent civilians and children vulnerable to injury or death long after hostilities have ceased.

Relief organizations and the United Nations Mine Action Coordination Center reported finding evidence that Israel used three types of U.S.-made cluster bombs during the war with Hezbollah militants. Israel also manufactures its own cluster munitions.

"For too long, innocent civilians, not enemy combatants, have suffered the majority of casualties from cluster munitions," Leahy said. "The recent experience in Lebanon is only the latest example of the appalling human toll of injury and death. Strict rules of engagement are long overdue."

But Sen. Ted Stevens, R-Alaska, said, "The rules of engagement properly belong with the Department of Defense and the commander in chief."

Stevens argued that the amendment would restrict "the ability of our military to use these munitions to protect our people."
"Compassionate" conservatism at work.

Jeez, I suppose it is just the "hearing a song everywhere" effect that I'm noticing Senator Ted Stevens's name everywhere.

What're your thoughts on the use of cluster bombs, and the above article's motion about them? (I support the restrictions as a good first step)

~Mecha
 
I

IntheNet

Guest
#2
Mecha said:
What're your thoughts on the use of cluster bombs, and the above article's motion about them? (I support the restrictions as a good first step)

I don't like telling the military to fight wars then telling them we plan to take away their tools to win. Cluster bombs and other explosives have a definite need. When trying to eliminate runways and other road assets or terrorists hiding in cover, cluster bombs are useful. Futher, one of the reasons were were so successful in Operation Desert Storm in the 1990s was through the use of cluster bombs against Iraqi Republican Guard outposts.

But the larger point here is we shouldn't be telling soldiers that we plan to take their hardware away while telling them to win! Soldiers are best able to determine the use or non-use of cluster bombs, not politicans!

This is yet another example of liberal lefty Dems exercising their "cut & run" strategy!!

If the Pentagon deems cluster bombs useful, then let them make the call!!!
 

Merc

Certified Shitlord
V.I.P.
#3
IntheNet said:
This is yet another example of liberal lefty Dems exercising their "cut & run" strategy!!

If the Pentagon deems cluster bombs useful, then let them make the call!!!
See, this is a major problem you seem to have. You never question authority and anyone who does you deem a leftist liberal (once again, a most redundant statement if I've ever heard one). So if the Pentagon came out tomorrow and said that shooting yourself in the foot is a good way to cure athelete's foot, you wouldn't question them?
 
I

IntheNet

Guest
#4
The Mercenary said:
See, this is a major problem you seem to have. You never question authority and anyone who does you deem a leftist liberal (once again, a most redundant statement if I've ever heard one). So if the Pentagon came out tomorrow and said that shooting yourself in the foot is a good way to cure athelete's foot, you wouldn't question them?

The Mercenary: I can tell you've never been in the military. Nor have you ever been in a position where bad people are trying to kill you; i.e., military police or like law enforcement position. How do I know that? Your statement above, i.e., "question authority".

We send the military to defend us. That is what they do. A similiar responsibility is shared by military police and law enforcement. They defend us. And within their ranks, there is no "questioning authority" at all. You do what you are told. I did; I have served in the Armed Forces. And I learned to do what I was told. Why? Because lives count on such obediance.

And when the Armed Forces says they have a need for "cluster munitions" I don't for a minute question them. Why? Because many brave men in Commannd Authroity with years of service makes such decisions. Not politicians looking for your vote. Brave soldiers who defend your butt and provide you the freedom that you use every day.

So go ahead and ignore the military Mercenary; make your decisions about armaments and munitions based upon what some kiss-the-baby politician says, rather than what a soldier says. That is very typical of you.

Back up what you say about liberalism or don't post.-Kaz
 
M

Mecha

Guest
#5
So does that mean you'd side with top military lawyers over the civilian leadership? (ie about torture, ect)

~Mecha
 

Merc

Certified Shitlord
V.I.P.
#6
IntheNet said:
The Mercenary: I can tell you've never been in the military. Nor have you ever been in a position where bad people are trying to kill you; i.e., military police or like law enforcement position. How do I know that? Your statement above, i.e., "question authority".

We send the military to defend us. That is what they do. A similiar responsibility is shared by military police and law enforcement. They defend us. And within their ranks, there is no "questioning authority" at all. You do what you are told. I did; I have served in the Armed Forces. And I learned to do what I was told. Why? Because lives count on such obediance.

And when the Armed Forces says they have a need for "cluster munitions" I don't for a minute question them. Why? Because many brave men in Commannd Authroity with years of service makes such decisions. Not politicians looking for your vote. Brave soldiers who defend your butt and provide you the freedom that you use every day.

So go ahead and ignore the military Mercenary; make your decisions about armaments and munitions based upon what some kiss-the-baby politician says, rather than what a soldier says. That is very typical of you.

Back up what you say about liberalism or don't post.-Kaz
Seriously, can you try not to be so damned ignorant? You're making this about soldiers, this is not what it's about. You seem to have this clueless idea that the Pentagon is just a bunch of generals discussing war strategy. I have nothing against the soldiers that defend us, none at all. That doesn't mean that I cannot question the men giving them orders. Do you seriously think we should trust the Pentagon and government 100%, no question? That's called blind loyalty and it leads to manipulation.

Your ability to ignore questions posed to you and misunderstand the english language is amazing. By making it seem that I have something against the troops and coming after me like the typical gun-toting republican bigot you are, you are simply proving that you have no real response to what I said because you do trust authority with all of yourself. To me, that's just a stupid way of going about things.
 
Top