"Mr. Gorbachev, tear down this wall"

pro2A

Hell, It's about time!
#1
It's too bad Reagan is not around today... this country is going into the opposite direction. :shake: We're going in the direction we fought so hard to get away from. Today is the anniversary of the fall of the Berlin wall... and those under the oppression of Communism and socialism flooded into freedom and liberty.

YouTube - Reagan - Tear Down This Wall
 

dDave

Guardian of the Light
V.I.P.
#3
I didn't realize what today was until I checked out this thread.

I saw the flag flying half staff today on campus though I didn't think much of it.

That speech is legendary though. I wish that we still had a president like reagan...
 

Babe_Ruth

Sultan of Swat
Staff member
V.I.P.
#6
Pro he was quoting Ddave's reply not yours.

Definitely a great speech by Ronald Reagan, I only saw it for the first time when they were honoring him after he passed away.
 

FindMuck

Registered Member
#7
You guys do realize that Gorbachev deserves all the credit for the wall coming down, not Reagan. Oh and Pro2a the US is not moving anywhere near to communism, and that is not the ultimate goal of every - or even any - social reform that tries to raise the standard of living for people for whom in other countries with similar gdp's and governments that reform would be a given, akin to basic human rights in terms of social norms and governmental legislation. What Reagan should have said was: "thank you Gorbachev for tearing down that wall, and may all future political world leaders have the audacity to do what is right above what is expected as you have shown yourself to have done." However I guess the phrase "credit where credit is due" applies only to those who follow the Reaganomics doctrine? :rolleyes:
 
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CaptainObvious

Son of Liberty
V.I.P.
#8
You guys do realize that Gorbachev deserves all the credit for the wall coming down, not Reagan.
Um, what? He did all by himself, huh? Where? In Bizarro world?

However I guess the phrase "credit where credit is due" applies only to those who follow the Reaganomics doctrine? :rolleyes:
No, obviously not. That applies to people who don't deserve all the credit apparently.

By the way, what do his economics have to do with anything?
 
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FindMuck

Registered Member
#9
Um, what? He did all by himself, huh? Where? In Bizarro world?
Wow solid argument. :lol:
No, obviously not. That applies to people who don't deserve all the credit apparently.
Reagan can bitch and whine all day and night in what you call "speeches" the fact is that Gorbachev was the one who initiated action, Gorbachev was the one who faced the consequences, Gorbachev was the one that ended the cold war, and Gorbachev is the one that deserves the credit for all that, not Reagan.

By the way, what do his economics have to do with anything?
What do economics have to do with politics. The whole cold war was about economics.
 

Sim

Registered Member
#10
I have to agree with FindMuck. Ronald Reagan made a great speech, and he may or may not have been a good President, but he is not at all responsible for the fall of the Berlin Wall.

80% of the credit goes to the courageous people in Poland, East Germany, Hungary and other countries in the East Bloc who protested on the streets and pushed for freedom and democracy, and 20% goes to Gorbachev, the Hungarian and Czechoslovakian leaders and others who decided to end the Cold War, instead of responding to the protest with a blood bath like the leaders of China.

Reagan had really nothing to do with it. He was not even President anymore when the Wall fell in late 1989.

Oh, and pro2A, your country is in no way approaching anything likely socialism as in the East Bloc, no matter what the completely hysteric anti-Obama psychotics tell you. The people here were fed up with the system in the East Bloc, because there were no free elections, because there was a secret police spying on the people and arresting everybody who disagreed with the government, because the government used torture and oppressed the people -- NOT because there was public health care in these countries.

If any President has made the US approaching this example of the East Bloc, it was George Bush: Thanks to him, the government uses torture, the secret service kidnapped people from the streets and denied them fair trials. Many East Germans hate Bush, just because he did exactly the same as the communist leaders they pushed away in 1989. Obama, on the other hand, is attempting to end these policies again, in order to bring America once again closer to the ideal of freedom and democracy it allegedly stands for, and for which the people in the East Bloc protested in 1989.

Two years ago, I visited a former Stasi prison (East German secret service spying on the people) in East Berlin, which now is a museum. The guide there was a former political prisoner. He explicitly mentioned that the practizes that were used by the communists are exactly the same as America under Bush started using, and that the believes since America has abandoned their ideals, his fight for freedom in 1989 was in vain.

But of course, you don't care about these facts, because you are a partisan hypocrite who gives a f*** about freedom, democracy and human rights, because all you have is a severe case of Obama derangement syndrome.
 
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