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"Modern" Feminism...Let's Discuss

Shwa

Well-Known Member
V.I.P.
In an idela world, we would want equality between sexes, races, nationalities, so on and so forth. However, we know today there is not much equality out there in the working world, government, private sector and more ares. That doesn't mean there are not strives to fix age-old stereotypes.

From my understanding, the original goal for Feminism was to make sure equality was just that. Equal rights and expectations to males and females in the working world for women mostly to be seen as hard working and socially stable as their male counterparts. In the past couple years though, it seems that the feminist movement has taken a turn for the ugly and tries to establish itself as the dominate, more fit sex out there. While I understand women can do much better things than men can in some instances, for the most part I see it as fair as long as you put your effort and carry your weight. But that's just me. From what I've been researching, it seems modern feminist could care less about the struggles men have to go through as long as they are subservient to their female counterparts in all aspects. Emotionally, physically, mentally, etc.

Honestly, it's a reason I can't take feminism seriously at all, it's just a bash on one side without providing sufficient facts or statistics. Nothing but complaining without trying to better their female peers and always appear to be the victims. Recently, Buzz Feed came out with a video of "feminist women" asking questions for men to answer, and honestly, it was insulting. Gay or not, their questions were condescending, one-sided and unprofessional. It wasn't until I found a rebuttal video that I finally had my stance on this who thing.

But that's just my outlook on the whole thing. What are your thoughts? Is "Modern" feminism toxic to those who are simply trying to achieve equality for real concerns women have? I'll link the video below for view:


~Shwa
 

Impaired

Registered Member
As soon as you start making generalization about a group you are almost always wrong.

Feminists come in all kinds.

As to them not giving a crap about men's rights, well duh. They are shooting for having the same rights as men, not fighting for men's rights.
 

Shwa

Well-Known Member
V.I.P.
As soon as you start making generalization about a group you are almost always wrong.

Feminists come in all kinds.

As to them not giving a crap about men's rights, well duh. They are shooting for having the same rights as men, not fighting for men's rights.
Women have the same rights if not more than men are granted, but statistics goes to show its a double edged sword. Just like men, you cannot have your cake and eat it too. However, it's not a generalization when you have the majority if not half the populous of "feminist" making outrageous, assumptions over statistics and facts, assuming men are their main enemy over a supposed "patriarchy"; and blatantly getting by with little to no concern about their male counterparts as a human being themselves. Appearing to be "selfish victims" and going on with that excuse. So, it begs the question: When did the oppressed become the oppressors?

Am I saying women do not have the complete equal rights as men? No, there are instances where it would morally seem unfair in many instances, but, that does not mean it's the same if you flip it around.

I am assuming you didn't even watch the video, please review to get a better understanding of the situation and topic at hand. A simple "As soon as you start making generalization about a group you are almost always wrong" statement is translated to, "I'm going to put my fingers in my ear and ignore anything anyone else has to say about said topic because you put everyone into one group because I said so". Well, to that I say tough titties. It happens to the African-American community, LGBT community, Political and other groups who have a sub group that reflects bad on the community, but it gets generalized as a whole no matter the instance. Feminist are no different.

~Shwa
 

Merc

Problematic Shitlord
V.I.P.
Like a lot of good causes, I believe too many people are concerned with themselves and are inadvertently ruining a decent thing.

Is air conditioning sexist? No.
Does disliking female actresses make you a raging misogynist? No.
Can you choose a liberal arts major and then complain about lack of women in STEM fields? Not really.
Is manspreading real? No (Bonus! Does making up sexist terms make you a believable proponent of gender equality? That's a no, too)

Are women in the middle east commonly forced to mutilate their genitals in order to reduce sexual satisfaction so they won't cheat on their husbands? Yes. Yes they are.

I want equal opportunities for us all, but the new definition of American activism follows a painfully privileged, unproductive, and predictable cycle: exaggeration of a minor event, feigned outrage, going viral, and then slacktivism (look at me wearing a safety pin in public, it means I'm a portable safe space!). There is no point where any real problem solving seems to happen, we just do our best to make sure our friends and acquaintances know how much we care and then forget about it (Kony who?)

Also, like any loud group, the worst of the feminists tend to make the front page of news sites and papers so it's easy to mock or hate them and it's definitely easy to point out the ones that are only in it because #KillAllMen and "muh patriarchy". It's getting overrun with reactionaries and not nearly enough actual progress. Everything is about how mad they can get with things and that's it.
 

Impaired

Registered Member
However, it's not a generalization when you have the majority if not half the populous of "feminist" making outrageous, assumptions over statistics and facts, assuming men are their main enemy over a supposed "patriarchy"; and blatantly getting by with little to no concern about their male counterparts as a human being themselves.
Yes, it certainly is a generalization and again, why do feminists concerned about fair treatment of women need to be concerned with the rights of those they see as the oppressor?

Just because somebody cares about X does not mean they have to feel the same way about Y.
 

Impaired

Registered Member
Yes, it certainly is a generalization and again, why do feminists concerned about fair treatment of women need to be concerned with the rights of those they see as the oppressor? You're made up figure of over half is just that, imaginary.

Just because somebody cares about X does not mean they have to feel the same way about Y.
 

Shwa

Well-Known Member
V.I.P.
You didn't watch the video, that already is apparent.

The fact of the matter is that men, this supposed patriarchy, are not the enemies of these so called activist for women's right. When I say activists, I do actually mean the ones who are trying to better then balance for all. However, starting a campaign with the slogan of "If you have a dick, you are my enemy" will get no one anywhere fast. When the vast majority of women are the ones causing the problems to their own sex.

Just because somebody cares about X does not mean they have to feel the same way about Y.
In an ideal mindset, no. However, this isn't ideal. This is playing the victim card and continuously crying about it and throwing a tantrum to hopefully advance towards a solution. However, these feminist do nothing but shut down conferences, make false rape allegations, lie on statistics and so on. Not very productive if they want to be considered a group with serious issues and concerns.

~Shwa
 

Bubbles

I ♥ Haters
The problem with third wave feminism is that it's lost sight of what's important and tends to focus way too much on stupid first world problems. First wave feminism was all about the suffragettes and the right to vote, second wave feminism was about fighting for women's sexual and reproductive rights, as well as other social issues like equal pay for equal work etc. The current movement, however, is a complete disgrace. It's basically a competition to see who can get more angry at what. I blame social media for most of it. Any reject with pink hair and a tumblr account can gaslight men and call themselves a feminist. Take video games and gaming in general, for example. Every time I hear someone moan about the lack of women in the industry, or men designing scantily clad female characters, I just wanna slap them. Because a) there are plenty of women in the gaming industry like Jade Raymond (Assassin's Creed II), Kim Swift (Portal series), Amy Henning (Uncharted) and god knows how many more talented women who work behind the scenes; b) while there are definitely a lot of female gamers out there, video games are still largely aimed at men. Men are designing games for, surprise, MEN! Are we really accusing men of not being women? Then I think men in the gaming industry might be guilty. For fuck's sake.

And when looking at the bigger picture, all this shit is a non-issue because there are a lot fucked up things happening to women in the developing world. Everything from bride burnings to honour killings to little girls getting shot in the face point blank for wanting to go to school to fucking acid attacks. And what are new wave feminists worried about? First world problems like Lara Croft's tits being to big and shaming Steve Martin for calling Carrie Fisher "a beautiful woman." Our priorities are so fucked up, it's hard to take anything we say seriously anymore.

Hell, some feminists will even attack other women for not fitting the mold. R/Feminism and on occasion r/AskWomen on reddit is a great examples of that. Shave your legs? Traitor. Wear make up? Traitor. Have a man at home? Traitor. Wanna be a loving mother and wife someday? Fuck you, you fucking traitor. I've never seen so much anger in one community before. When did feminism become the Red Pill? Yeesh. I'm gonna stop here before I get a rage aneurysm.
 

Impaired

Registered Member
You didn't watch the video, that already is apparent.

The fact of the matter is that men, this supposed patriarchy, are not the enemies of these so called activist for women's right. When I say activists, I do actually mean the ones who are trying to better then balance for all. However, starting a campaign with the slogan of "If you have a dick, you are my enemy" will get no one anywhere fast. When the vast majority of women are the ones causing the problems to their own sex.



In an ideal mindset, no. However, this isn't ideal. This is playing the victim card and continuously crying about it and throwing a tantrum to hopefully advance towards a solution. However, these feminist do nothing but shut down conferences, make false rape allegations, lie on statistics and so on. Not very productive if they want to be considered a group with serious issues and concerns.

~Shwa
The problem is I do not agree with you about your base premise that this represents the majority of feminists or even modern ones.

Most of the women I know are feminists to one degree or another. One seriously considers anything with a penis 'the enemy' and she is even married to a guy. She doesn't hate all men, but she does think the system is rigged against her and anyone with a penis would get more respect. She's in upper management and the blatant sexism there is rubbed in her face every day, or so she says.

I don't know. I'm a guy. I lack the gonads to properly appreciate the situation.

I wouldn't begin to pretend to know what being black or gay or a million other states of being.

I don't think most feminists make false rape allegations. I think YOU paint with too broad a brush. Clearly, you disagree and think most feminists are as you say.

End of the line.
 

Shwa

Well-Known Member
V.I.P.
The problem is I do not agree with you about your base premise that this represents the majority of feminists or even modern ones.

Most of the women I know are feminists to one degree or another. One seriously considers anything with a penis 'the enemy' and she is even married to a guy. She doesn't hate all men, but she does think the system is rigged against her and anyone with a penis would get more respect. She's in upper management and the blatant sexism there is rubbed in her face every day, or so she says.

I don't know. I'm a guy. I lack the gonads to properly appreciate the situation.

I wouldn't begin to pretend to know what being black or gay or a million other states of being.

I don't think most feminists make false rape allegations. I think YOU paint with too broad a brush. Clearly, you disagree and think most feminists are as you say.

End of the line.
1) I'm a guy as well, what's your point? I can see both sides of the spectrum as well as anyone else can. I don't care if anyone disagrees with me, however when it's simply elementary "No you're wrong because I said so" mentality then it's not much of a discussion. What I've tried to get out of you all through this thread is finally answered with a somewhat poor example of a scenario.

2) No one cares, that's not the discussion point I made with this thread. Stay focused.

On the rape allegation and you believing that's my only stance on it, you must be new to the law to completely ignore the presumption of innocence or guilty until proven innocent process anyone has to go through. I know there are more than one feminist type out there, clearly, but as I mentioned in this thread in the original OP, I speak of "modern man hating" feminist that foreshadow the rest. Please pay attention.

But once again, you won't educate yourself when facts are presented, you've argued with me about the whole LGBT sexuality B.S I mentioned, and this thread is no different to "trigger" a response for you for the sake of making a post. So, not really a surprise.

It may be you end of the line, but not mine for a mature discussion on a topic brought up in today's world.

~Shwa
 
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