Lee wins Cy Young, Halladay finishes second

Discussion in 'Baseball' started by Babe_Ruth, Nov 13, 2008.

  1. Babe_Ruth

    Babe_Ruth Sultan of Swat Staff Member V.I.P.


  2. Millz

    Millz Black 7! Staff Member V.I.P.

    Cliff Lee should have been a slam dunk winner this season...and he won. I'm amazed the writers are getting all these winners correct.
     
  3. Babe_Ruth

    Babe_Ruth Sultan of Swat Staff Member V.I.P.

    Come on Millz, Halladay pitched really well this season, if he got more run support he would be close to 30 wins this season, I think in his eleven lost this season he got 2.3 runs per game, now I know your team isn't always going to score tons of points for you every game you take the mound. But saying he was a slam dunk to win is a bit much.
     
  4. Millz

    Millz Black 7! Staff Member V.I.P.

    Did anybody outside of Toronto even think Halladay had a remote chance of winning the Cy Young this year? If you've read anything I've posted you'll know that I think wins is an overrated statistic...too much luck involved with it.

    But the writers do think its a big deal so there ya go. The fact of the matter is Lee had a better ERA and more wins...the "sexy" stats. He was the best pitcher in the league the entire season. Granted Halladay's numbers are sick, but overall Lee had the better year if you ask me. I'm not shocked Lee won by so many votes cuz seriously, where did this come from?

    Lee lost three games this season too...THREE GAMES.
     
  5. Babe_Ruth

    Babe_Ruth Sultan of Swat Staff Member V.I.P.

    I think a lot of people outside Toronto believed that Roy Halladay had a remote chance to win the Cy Young, and if you ask every American League manager who they believed was the best pitcher this season, they'll probably say Halladay. They've interviewed a lot of manager this season before the game when Halladay was pitching, and they all believed he was the best.

    You might think I'm bias because I'm a Jays fan, but if you watch him go out there every game then you'll realize that he's better then Lee.

    Dont get me wrong here, I'm not denying what Lee did this season, having three loses his remarkable. His E.R.A was outstanding, but Halladay's was pretty close, Halladay threw 23 more innings then Lee did.

    Halladay gave up 39 total walks, struck out 206 batters, Halladay's whip was at 1,053 while Lee was at 1.110, Halladays ERA+ was at 154 while Lee's was at 175. So if you look at the total numbers, then you had the run support and the harder teams that Halladay faced this year, and I believe that Halladay was the better pitcher, he might of lost more games then him, but that's totally not all his fault.

    So I don't just look at wins, I look at the total picture.
     
  6. Millz

    Millz Black 7! Staff Member V.I.P.

    Nobody should ever...EVER just look at a stupid stat like wins. ERA, WHIP and ERA+ are the main stats IMO.

    There's no denying Halladay was awesome, is awesome and will always be awesome but I just didnt see a reason to vote against Lee this year. And I didnt think the writers would vote against him either. I'm taking nothing away from Roy because really he's the top guy I would want to trade for if I'm looking at every pitcher in the majors.
     
  7. Babe_Ruth

    Babe_Ruth Sultan of Swat Staff Member V.I.P.

    If you compare both pitchers, Halladay wins in almost every pitching categories, the only that Lee has better is the number of lost, and his ERA, but Halladay is fairly close to Lee's ERA, and Halladay as pitched 20+ innings more then Lee.

    With that being said, I am just wondering what are the main factors your looking at right now that determins Lee was better overall this season.
     
  8. StroShow

    StroShow The return shall be legenday! V.I.P. Lifetime

    Millz just look at the competetion Halladay had to face also everytime he stepped on that mound: Tampa Bay Devil Rays(AL East Winners) Boston Red Sox(AL Wild Card winners) and the New York Yankees(the line-up speaks for itself). Who did Lee face most of the time: Twins and White Sox were great teams, but nowhere near as talented as the teams mentioned above. Also there's so many times that Halladay lost a 1-0 game this year, but yet pitched a complete game. And saying that outside Toronto no one expected Halladay to contend for the CY Young is comeple BS. Just to mention one name on the American side: Ken Rosenthal predicted him to win the CY Young, and Steve Phillips from ESPN also gave Halladay the best chances to win the Cy Young this year. IMO the better numbers won it, but not the better pitcher.
     
  9. Merc

    Merc Certified Shitlord V.I.P. Lifetime

    Halladay had no chance because he was no better than Lee, it's nearly impossible to agrue.
     
  10. Millz

    Millz Black 7! Staff Member V.I.P.

    Sometimes it's not only about the stats but the player. Where the hell did Cliff Lee come from? He had one season in which he won 18 games, sure, but he fell off the face of the earth. He's the better story.

    It's not a mistake that he won a by a HUGE margin over Halladay in the voting...he dominated the voting. He was demoted to the minors last year and went a major league-best 22-3 this season with a 2.54 ERA. He received 24 of 28 first-place votes and 132 points in balloting by the Baseball Writers’ Association of America. Again, dominating. Roy Halladay was a distant runner-up with four first-place votes and 71 points. The fact he won 22 games for a crappy team says alot for what kind of player Lee was this past season. If the writers always went off statistics then alot of the voting would be completely different. Albert Pujols would have 5 MVP awards...there's more to it then that.

    Halladay's numbers are comparable but why didn't he sniff Cliff Lee? 22-3 and a sick ERA for a shitty team, that's why. Dont get me wrong Halladay had an awesome season but there was no doubt who was going to win.
     

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