Discussion in 'Religion & Philosophy' started by Clear_Note, May 31, 2008.
Do the people who crucified Jesus go to heaven or hell?
I'm going to guess- fuck it, you know they went to Hell.
But Jesus was supposed to die for everyone's sins. That means god would have had to hand pick people to crucify him against their will so that he would die for their sins. If that's true God is just an ass and being Christian doesn't help with the afterlife.
Hand pick if you go by the whole predestination bit. Jesus died for everyone's sins doesn't mean he walked up to them and said "crucify me". The people who killed Jesus would go to hell since murder is a sin.
You are saved by grace through faith. Besides, the early church primarily believed hell was not eternal, so the people who crucified Jesus don't have to worry about eternal condemnation anyway.
Jesus submitted Himself under mans authority! Which means that the Jews were over Jesus, thereby offering Him up as a sacrifice for all mankind.
But Jesus after the Crucifixion, became King of all nations and all mankind.
Which means, that now we all have an advocate with the Father by which we can all approach the Father via Jesus boldly and without hesitation.
The Jesus were blinded purposely by the Father so that they would be the ones chosen to offer up such a sacrifice for all mankind.
The Jews then, are held innocent, for Jesus said, "...Father, forgive them for they KNOW NOT, what they do..."
Salvation than is offered to all souls. Question is, do we want it?
For all man kind? The apostle John says Joh 1:12 But as many as received Him, He gave to them authority to become the children of God, to those who believe on His name,
There are many that do not received Him. What will become of these ones?
Amen, Joh 3:14 But even as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, even so must the Son of Man be lifted up,
Joh 3:15 so that whosoever believes in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Joh 3:16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only-begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.
But they don’t all believe. What about them?
God is omniscient and new that they would turn, He know what their response to His calling was going to be
Yes it seems that they were forgiven, did they believe in Jesus? Are they in the Lord? believes in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
It appears that not all of mankind wants it what will became of them?
This is not a Christian doctrine, only those that believe in God/Jesus are saved, unbelievers are reprobate.
No, it doesn't mean that. I'm not sure where you found this perverted idea but I would suggest a reading of the gospels, better yet the entire new testament to get a better understanding of what your trying to talk about.
Well, how do people go to Heaven in the first place?
Jesus Christ died for our sins, the only people who do go to Heaven are those who are saved from sin through Him. (1 Corinthians 15:22, "For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ all shall be made alive."; John 3:16, "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.")
So, to rephrase your question to fit in with what I just said, "Do the people who crucified Jesus have the chance to decide whether to go to heaven or hell?"
The answer is, yes. They have a free will whether to decide to go to Heaven or Hell, they have a free will to accept Jesus or to reject Him. Paul murdered Christians, and God forgave him. (In fact, the Holy Spirit wrote about half of the New Testament through Paul) Just as long as they were still alive, they had a chance to accept Him.
So whether they went to Heaven or Hell is based off of whether they accepted Jesus afterwards.
"that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation." -Romans 10:9-10
"saved" means, saved from sin.
(Always look for scripture reference when people talk about Christ, even when people give scripture reference, you can't tell whether what they are saying is aligned with the Bible. If any of you want more reference, just ask.)
also, Hebrews 2:9, "But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels, for the suffering of death crowned with glory and honor, that He, by the grace of God, might taste death for everyone."
notice, "everyone." This isn't saying everyone goes to Heaven, this is saying He died for everyone. It is up to you whether to accept what He did for you and be saved from sin, or not.
I believe this is the doctrine of predestination you will find in Calvinism. Instead of free will, it states that everything is God ordained. :-/
Our actions don't carry much weight when it comes to salvation-- the grace of God does. Actually I believe there was a legend about the soldier who pierced Jesus's side becoming a Christian. This same soldier went on to become a Centurion, but soon he was ordered to be executed for his faith. His entire legion lined up behind him when he put his head on the block, because they would rather suffer his same punishment than go on without him.
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