Has the US become China's Whipping Post?

Discussion in 'Other Discussions' started by icegoat63, Feb 4, 2010.

  1. icegoat63

    icegoat63 Son of Liberty V.I.P. Lifetime

    I've been sitting back idly watching the US Financial situation through analytical glasses for the last year or two. One thing I've seen alot of is basically this:

    All in all not so bad. China being very helpful to a strong world power that is going through a time of need. Builds bonds and helps strengthen an otherwise odd relationship.

    But then I saw this article yesterday and I think it all kinda hit me like a 10 ton brick.

    Now I'm not trying to be a conspiracy theorist here, but I'd like to point out the obvious.... The US has had an evident working relationship with Tibet since the Days of FDR and WWII. The US even silently backed the sentiment of Tibet being its own nation (as seen in the Truman Era Passport thing we learned about in the Boring Chapters of the History Books). Did China Neuter the US by buying out our Debt?

    Because from my standpoint it doesn't sound like we as a Nation can do much anymore. China owns us in a way that we havent seen before. All it would take is a calling of those loans for China to sit back and watch the US Economy just Crash & Burn.

    Any thoughts on this? Am I missing some pieces? What are your thoughts of China manhandling the US Relations like this?


    edit: Sorry for those that caught this thread early and saw all that horrible code that carried over when I copy/pasted the Articles. It should be fixed now.
     
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2010

  2. Mirage

    Mirage Administrator Staff Member V.I.P.

    Well, as the saying goes, "The borrower is slave to the lender."

    If we don't do what China says then guess what? They call our debt and we're screwed. I don't know about the hope factor there but change would definitely be imminent.

    I don't think a Chinese takeover of the US (non-war) would be too far fetched as a possibility. I mean, have you ever heard the term foreclosure? It could happen and there's absolutely nothing we could do about it.
     
  3. Wade8813

    Wade8813 Registered Member

    I'm not sure China's quite to the point where they can manhandle us, but if they can, it's our fault.

    The thing is, we already have tons of debt. If China went too far in their demands or if they really did try to make our economy tank, we'd just go back into the debt we had. It'd suck, but whatever.
     
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2010
  4. viLky

    viLky ykLiv

    You can't go around stepping on people's toes when you owe them something. Obama going to meet with the Dalai Lama would be a terrible mistake. What the US needs to do is ignore China's human rights issues and the Dalai Lama. Stay away from China and any interests that might have a negative impact put upon the US.

    Remember the saying: you got to help yourself before you help others. Once we get out of this hole we're in go ahead and knock yourself out butting in China's issues.
     
  5. Bananas

    Bananas Endangered Species

    Not so much whipping post but certainly end up in their pocket and have less and less leaway at the table. China may not ahve the military tech to take on the US but economically it could cripple it out of existence if needs be.



    Your missing one big piece of the puzzle; Taiwan.

    Tibet is pretty much resolved, its a part of China and nobody is going to challenge it with any conviction. Taiwan is a whole new ball game yet to be resolved. I always remember when Thatcher was negotiating the return of Hong-Kong to China at one point it was reminded that if the UK did not become flexible on the demands it was implementing then China could easily just march across the border and take what was theirs. They made it clear that Hong-Kong was not to be another Falklands.

    So far the story of Taiwan has gone slightly different, with the US on side China cant call the shots.......for now. If China cant take Taiwan with military means, it could always do it with economic might.
     
    icegoat63 likes this.
  6. Wade8813

    Wade8813 Registered Member

    I should also point out that for a while now I've been saying I won't be surprised if China takes over the world...


    (I wonder if being half Chinese would help any if they took over?)
     
  7. ExpectantlyIronic

    ExpectantlyIronic e̳̳̺͕ͬ̓̑̂ͮͦͣ͒͒h̙ͦ̔͂?̅̂ ̾͗̑

    This is really just a self-fulfilling prophecy. With everyone speaking as if we're in China's pocket or something, it would have been amazing if China didn't try and capitalize on that misperception, but the truth of matters is that China would be fucked if they fucked us, since we buy their stuff so their economy can grow (the fate of nations is largely interconnected these days). They aren't just helping us out because they're super-friendly and nice. Plus, I have to imagine that they enjoy the interest we pay them on the money they lend. It's not like we couldn't get that money through other means, like a large tariff on Chinese imports, which would be a major kick to our balls, but I can't imagine it would be great for China, either. A less vindictive means of making up for China not buying our debt, would be to offer more interest, and thereby entice other buyers to pick up the slack (or, y'know, raise taxes and/or lower spending).
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2010
  8. Swiftstrike

    Swiftstrike Registered Member

    China and the U.S. are dependent on each other. It is a symbiotic relationship simply for the fact that China own's a lot of our debt but calling in such a debt would devalue the U.S. Dollar (which is already struggling).

    They want to keep the U.S. Dollar as high as possible.

    We aren't dependent on China as many people perceive us to be.

    Also every decade or so declinist predict the David that will slay Goliath and everytime they have been wrong.

    In the 1970s it was the USSR, in the 1980s it was Japan, in the 1990s it was the EU and Islamic countries. This is just another trend.
     
  9. Wade8813

    Wade8813 Registered Member

    To be fair, the USSR was horribly mismanaged; Japan is tiny and many Japanese people love all things US; the EU has the disadvantage of being several separate countries, so they have internal conflict, plus many of them like us (or want to like us); Islamic countries generally lack the resources, and while their fanaticism is great for being willing to do crazy things that most would shy away from, it also leads to inefficiency (killing yourself when you could just as easily walk away to fight another day).

    China, on the other hand, has a decent amount of problems, but has been resolving (some of) them at a surprising rate recently. They have the world's largest population, good technology, etc. They kind of like us, but have a culture of fierce nationalism and a willingness to do things that strain relations if they think they can get away with it. I get the impression that they've been trying to learn from their mistakes, and the mistakes of a lot of other countries.

    I don't think China (or anyone else) is going to take over the US for at least several decades (I won't say longer than that because so much can change in that time). But I wouldn't be too surprised if they did.
     

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