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Court takes obese family's newborn..

AngelsPeak

Wanna play?
I know we've had discussions on this topis before, but I still find it incredibly intersting that the courts intervene (or try to) over a childs obesity.
I noticed the story does state that there are other problems in the family that we are not aware of, but it seems as though the obesity is the main focus.

Courts Take Obese Family's Newborn, Is It Neglect? - ABC News

Should a court be allowed to intervene when a child becomes morbidly obese?
 

Jeanie

still nobody's bitch
V.I.P.
Yes absolutely someone should intervene when a child becomes morbidly obese. Obesity leads to numerous health problems including but not limited to diabetes, heart disease, high blood pressure, high cholesterol, anxiety, and depression. Obese children are at increased risk of obesity in adulthood.

It is the parents' responsibility to see that their children are healthy and well cared-for. Intervening in cases of morbid obesity is no different than intervening in cases of neglect in which the child is not being bathed or fed or given proper medical attention.
 

AnitaKnapp

It's not me, it's you.
V.I.P.
In this case, I don't think they had justification of taking the child. It was a newborn who was no obese...they simply took the child because the family is obese.

Honestly, I'm not really sure whether I would consider obesity in general as a reason for children to be taken away. It's still a very gray area, and I go back and forth with my opinion on this. I don't have a concrete one. On the one hand, I think the government should worry less about things like this and let parents raise their offspring as they see fit...on the other hand, these kids can't help it if they are being taught horrible habits birth and their parents are doing them a serious disservice that will probably seriously affect their mental health.
 

Merc

Problematic Shitlord
V.I.P.
I see it this way:

These parents (and the other 99% of obese parents) aren't stuffing food down their kids' throats or beating them for not eating five donuts every morning. People want them in trouble with the law because obesity can be dangerous. Keyword there, can. So if we can start arresting parents for putting their children in potential harm's way, then we may as well ban reproduction. Let's start with parents that have kids living in California. Hey, lots of earthquakes, right? The kids may die! Quick, rescue them! How about a parent driving their kids to school? Well, lots of people die in car accidents, arrest that wench!

This fear of obesity is overrated and under-researched. There have always been fat people and this kind of fear is just being fueled by the health food industry amongst other ridiculous groups that think eating a piece of fried chicken should be punishable by death. Tell me the mother is feeding her kid liquor, that she is feeding him drain cleaner, something immediately dangerous to his/her health.

I just can't buy this new "abuse" definition.
 

Jeanie

still nobody's bitch
V.I.P.
I see it this way:

These parents (and the other 99% of obese parents) aren't stuffing food down their kids' throats or beating them for not eating five donuts every morning. People want them in trouble with the law because obesity can be dangerous. Keyword there, can. So if we can start arresting parents for putting their children in potential harm's way, then we may as well ban reproduction. Let's start with parents that have kids living in California. Hey, lots of earthquakes, right? The kids may die! Quick, rescue them! How about a parent driving their kids to school? Well, lots of people die in car accidents, arrest that wench!

This fear of obesity is overrated and under-researched. There have always been fat people and this kind of fear is just being fueled by the health food industry amongst other ridiculous groups that think eating a piece of fried chicken should be punishable by death. Tell me the mother is feeding her kid liquor, that she is feeding him drain cleaner, something immediately dangerous to his/her health.

I just can't buy this new "abuse" definition.
You are wrong. Childhood obesity rates have more than doubled in the past 20 years, according to the CDC. Obesity IS dangerous. Not can be. IS. Obesity - a BMI of 30 or greater - is one of the leading preventable causes of death worldwide.
 

Merc

Problematic Shitlord
V.I.P.
You are wrong. Childhood obesity rates have more than doubled in the past 20 years, according to the CDC. Obesity IS dangerous. Not can be. IS. Obesity - a BMI of 30 or greater - is one of the leading preventable causes of death worldwide.
Okay, my grandma is 89, heavily obese, and she's still driving and living on her own. She ate heavy, hearty Italian food her whole life and she's never had a heart attack or any similar "obesity" problems.

How can you explain that?

It can be explained by the fact that obesity is not a guarantee to be dangerous, end of story. Think about it Jeanie, if we can arrest parents and take children for putting our children not in harm's way, but in harm's potential way, it will basically mean anyone who does anything even remotely dangerous could lose their children.

I'm not saying nothing should be done about obesity, the numbers are frightening. However, arresting parents is not going to fix anything. Obesity is a cultural problem.
 

Jeanie

still nobody's bitch
V.I.P.
These parents were not arrested. We are not talking about arresting parents. We are talking about intervention. Intervention need not be arresting. The law intervenes when a parent fails to secure their child safely in the car, which is dangerous but not always fatal, so why not when the parents put their kids at greatly increased risk of health problems? Danger doesn't necessarily mean guarantee of harm. It means increased risk of harm.
 

Merc

Problematic Shitlord
V.I.P.
These parents were not arrested. We are not talking about arresting parents. We are talking about intervention. Intervention need not be arresting. The law intervenes when a parent fails to secure their child safely in the car, which is dangerous but not always fatal, so why not when the parents put their kids at greatly increased risk of health problems? Danger doesn't necessarily mean guarantee of harm. It means increased risk of harm.
We may not be talking about arresting parents, but you'd have to be crazy to not see that this type of redefining of "abuse" would certainly lead to police "intervention". Not to mention, what do you think "intervention" means? Or, what does it mean to you? It's child services when I think of it. Those guys are basically child cops and they'll do what they can to take your kid from you. I know it because I have a very close friend who has had her dirt bag sister call child services several times because her mother wouldn't let her date a crackhead. I'm not exaggerating, seriously. Now her mother is a questionable source and parent whenever the law is involved in anything in her life.

Like I said earlier, should we "intervene" when parents move into cities with high crime rates? That's a health risk. What about parents that move to the midwest or far west, places with severe weather like hurricanes and seismic events?
 

Wade8813

Registered Member
"We will not comment in detail on any family with whom we are involved, but we have made it clear on numerous occasions that children would NOT be removed from a family environment just because of a weight issue," a press statement from the Dundee City Council read.
Just an FYI.



I see it this way:

These parents (and the other 99% of obese parents) aren't stuffing food down their kids' throats or beating them for not eating five donuts every morning.
That's true. But if your house is full of junk food, and you neglect your parental duty to put limits on your kids, then there is some amount of blame on you. A 5 year old kid doesn't have the knowledge or maturity to know to make healthy choices.

I'm NOT saying that kids should be taken away because of that; but I am saying there's some blame.

People want them in trouble with the law because obesity can be dangerous. Keyword there, can. So if we can start arresting parents for putting their children in potential harm's way, then we may as well ban reproduction. Let's start with parents that have kids living in California. Hey, lots of earthquakes, right? The kids may die! Quick, rescue them! How about a parent driving their kids to school? Well, lots of people die in car accidents, arrest that wench!
'Dangerous' and 'Can be dangerous' are the same thing. Dangerous doesn't mean you'll be harmed every time; it means there's a higher risk.

(Also, I'm pretty sure there's a risk of natural disasters everywhere in the world, so you can't really avoid it. No need to pick on California ;)).


Okay, my grandma is 89, heavily obese, and she's still driving and living on her own. She ate heavy, hearty Italian food her whole life and she's never had a heart attack or any similar "obesity" problems.

How can you explain that?
The same way you explain people who chain-smoke, or drink and drive, or use hard drugs, or play Russian Roulette. Not everyone who engages in dangerous activities will be harmed by it.
 

Merc

Problematic Shitlord
V.I.P.
Just an FYI.
Even though they did take the kids. Shows you how bullshit a press statement is typically worth.

:lol:

That's true. But if your house is full of junk food, and you neglect your parental duty to put limits on your kids, then there is some amount of blame on you. A 5 year old kid doesn't have the knowledge or maturity to know to make healthy choices.
But what is healthy? It varies from person to person. Some people live their lives eating a plate full of bacon, sausage and eggs every morning even though a lot of health "professionals" will tell you that's bad. The problem with obesity is that we apply the same health standards that work for a few dozen people and try to apply them to the country as a whole. It's idiotic and inefficient. What will cure one guy will kill the guy sitting next to him, that kind of idea is what I believe.

I'm NOT saying that kids should be taken away because of that; but I am saying there's some blame.
Blame for what? Is being fat a terminal illness?

'Dangerous' and 'Can be dangerous' are the same thing. Dangerous doesn't mean you'll be harmed every time; it means there's a higher risk.
A higher risk, based on very, very few unbiased studies. Most of these "facts" come from groups funded by healthy eating groups or health food companies. You can't say that there isn't going to be some stretched truth there. Obesity is a new scare and it has some legitimate concerns, but I've yet to see some seriously bothersome evidence that obesity is a severe risk.

(Also, I'm pretty sure there's a risk of natural disasters everywhere in the world, so you can't really avoid it. No need to pick on California ;)).
My point is still quite valid. If we're going to scrutinize parents for putting kids in danger's way, we may as well harp on all the mothers who lost their kids in Katrina because hey, we knew for a long time that the area was in a serious danger zone for flooding and destruction. Blaming parents for obesity and punishing them by taking their kids or "intervening" is not going to help anything, especially obesity.

A New York study found that even when fast food restaurants were forced to display calorie counts, fast food purchases rose. People for the most part, do not care what's in their food. As long as they can get it fast and cheap, they'll eat it. It's a symptom of society, not of poor individual choice.

The same way you explain people who chain-smoke, or drink and drive, or use hard drugs, or play Russian Roulette. Not everyone who engages in dangerous activities will be harmed by it.
Exactly.

:cool:

Then again, the danger level of obesity cannot be fact since health is different for everyone so why should we assume all fat people are ticking bombs?
 
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