• Welcome to the PopMalt Forums! Whether you're new to forums or a veteran, welcome to our humble home on the web! We're a 20-year old forum community with thousands of discussions on entertainment, lifestyle, leisure, and more.

    Our rules are simple. Be nice and don't spam. Registration is free, so what are you waiting for? Join today!.

MLB Bonds, Clemens, McGwire, Sosa etc

Millz

Better Call Saul
Staff member
V.I.P.
Are you of the mindset that those guys should be in the Hall of Fame or are you good with them not being in there? Pete Rose too, thoughts on him separately since it's a different circumstance with him.

I'll give my thoughts once the thread gets a reply or two.
 

Babe_Ruth

Sultan of Swat
Staff member
V.I.P.
I am more lenient on having Clemens or Bonds in the Hall of Fame then I was several years ago. However, I’m still a no. Check back in a couple of years and I may have my stance on them completely changed.

Pete Rose will always be a no for me. Can’t forgive what he did, and how long he denied it for then came out with the truth because he needed the money.

Shoeless Joe Jackson should be in. I’ve read enough about the Black Sox scandal, and truly believe that he knew about it, but did not do anything to cost his team to lose the World Series.
 

EdgeHead

Registered Member
I agree with @Babe_Ruth that in that list, only Shoeless Joe Jackson should be eligible for the Hall of Fame. Clemens, Bonds, Sosa, McGwire....I know some say put them in but with an asterisk but that wouldn't make sense to me. Especially when you made that much effort to clean up the sport.
 

Millz

Better Call Saul
Staff member
V.I.P.
The thing that sucks is there are probably tons of guys who did drugs who are in already, they just didn't get caught. Frank Thomas was a brick shithouse but he got in...maybe he did some steroids? We don't know. You're telling me Jeff Bagwell wasn't on something? He probably was but again, never caught.

I'd put them all in and base things on what they did on the field. Shoeless Joe too, the dude his like .350 in the 1919 Series, didn't he?

Pete Rose, I am so over him. He had time to come clean but more and more BS still comes out on him. He's a prick and what he did was different than all the rest.
 

Babe_Ruth

Sultan of Swat
Staff member
V.I.P.
The thing that sucks is there are probably tons of guys who did drugs who are in already, they just didn't get caught. Frank Thomas was a brick shithouse but he got in...maybe he did some steroids? We don't know. You're telling me Jeff Bagwell wasn't on something? He probably was but again, never caught.
Very valid point. I think Bagwell used. I’ve talked to people who had access to some clubhouses and they truly believed Piazza used. I do not think Thomas used – he is still very massive today. In addition, I always thought Biggio used at some point.
 

Millz

Better Call Saul
Staff member
V.I.P.
Very valid point. I think Bagwell used. I’ve talked to people who had access to some clubhouses and they truly believed Piazza used. I do not think Thomas used – he is still very massive today. In addition, I always thought Biggio used at some point.
Okay so the Piazza thing, yeah, same here. I guess it's okay to say since this happened in 2007 but when I worked for the St Louis Cardinals I was tasked to go with someone from MLB and take pictures of the stadium (it was new at the time) for the website. He was from New York and used to work in the Mets clubhouse and he claims he saw Mike Piazza use...and he's a hall of famer. He claims he saw Jose Lima do the same and he name dropped a few more like Paul Lo Duca, Julio Franco, and Oliver Perez. I believe they were all on the 2006 NY Mets. He mentioned he was pretty sure Carlos Delgado did too but never saw it actually happen. I dunno why the hell he was telling me all of this though lol. It felt pretty badass to get the scoop.

Anyway, it just furthers my point. Put them all in!
 

CaptainObvious

Embrace the Suck
V.I.P.
Pete Rose should definitely be in the Hall. Keeping him out is just dumb. He was one of the best hitters ever. Want to keep out of baseball in any other capacity? No problem, but the Hall should be about what one does on the field. Yes he's a jerk, so was Ty Cobb, and that jackass is in. Shoeless Joe without a doubt should be in.

Guys like Clemens and Bonds should be in as well. I used to say no, but my stance has changed somewhat.

By the way, Biggio? Bagwell maybe, but Biggio? A steroid user?
 

Millz

Better Call Saul
Staff member
V.I.P.
I changed my stance too, Captain. I used to think keep Clemens and Bonds and all them out...just don't think its worth the energy anymore. I would be more receptive of Rose if he didn't keep shooting himself in the foot with lies. It's 2018 and it seems like we find out more lies. But I wouldn't cry if he got in.

As far as Biggio, hey, we don't know. Steroids aren't always about getting huge and buff but can also be to keep you healthy and recover quicker. Maybe he was on HGH like Andy Pettitte was...Palmeiro wasn't huge. I remember Wally Joyner got caught, he wasn't a huge man. There were tons of pitchers who got caught who were super small dudes.

With all that said, it's not worth our time to sit here and guess and point fingers unless there is proof.

So far as I know, Biggio is clean and Bagwell is clean.
 
Last edited:

CaptainObvious

Embrace the Suck
V.I.P.
That's true, it's not always about getting big. Some use it just to recover quicker, and not necessarily to get bigger.

I feel the same way, unless there is proof, I will give anyone the benefit of the doubt. Bagwell no doubt got bigger as his career went on, and I wouldn't be surprised if he did, but unless we know for sure, they shouldn't be penalized based on suspicion.
 

Babe_Ruth

Sultan of Swat
Staff member
V.I.P.
I changed my stance dude, Captain. I used to think keep Clemens and Bonds and all them out...just don't think its worth the energy anymore. I would be more receptive of Rose if he didn't keep shooting himself in the foot with lies. It's 2018 and it seems like we find out more lies. But I wouldn't cry if he got in.

As far as Biggio, hey, we don't know. Steroids aren't always about getting huge and buff but can also be to keep you healthy and recover quicker. Maybe he was on HGH like Andy Pettitte was...Palmeiro wasn't huge. I remember Wally Joyner got caught, he wasn't a huge man. There were tons of pitchers who got caught who were super small dudes.

With all that said, it's not worth our time to sit here and guess and point fingers unless there is proof.

So far as I know, Biggio is clean and Bagwell is clean.
Another one is Neifi Perez. He was never huge. Piazza supposedly has told many writers off the record that he used PEDs. Jeff Pearlman's even mentions it in Clemens bio. I get my speculation for Biggio from the same people that were former sport writers.

I would be crushed if it ever came out that Delgado used. Same with Griffey.
 
Thread starter Similar threads Forum Replies Date
NewGamePlus Baseball 4
Babe_Ruth Baseball 6
Babe_Ruth Baseball 12
Millz Baseball 1
M Baseball 8
Top